[Other Sport] F1 2024

A1X said:

Because they’re not the same scenario?

Hamilton vs Verstappen was a clear racing incident, whereas this was a clear takeout by Verstappen.

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AstroSloth said:

Absolutely deluded lmao. Hamilton lets off on the wheel and ends up colliding with Verstappen and was all down to him.

He could have turned right to hit the apex but wanted to squeeze Max instead.

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Flounce said:

Given how Max drives under pressure it was exactly what Max deserved. Not the trip to hospital obviously. Even so when his car ended up on top of Hamilton’s he didn’t even stop to check if Lewis was OK as he walked away. The guy may be a great driver but he is also a ****

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AstroSloth said:

I didn't see people saying this when Hamilton put Verstappen in the wall and hospital at Silverstone lmao.

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AstroSloth said:

I didn't see people saying this when Hamilton put Verstappen in the wall and hospital at Silverstone lmao.

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Audax said:

Lots of people who follow F1 spoke negatively about Hamilton after that incident. If you didn't see it / don't remember it, you weren't paying enough attention. It was Hamilton's mistake. But it was exactly that: a one off mistake in a fraught and close battle against another driver who never gives an inch.

Max, on the other hand, has form. He has form for making very late, borderline dangerous, defensive moves that go unpunished. Because he has form for doing that, other drivers trying to overtake him also tend to resort to low percentage overtaking attempts (as Lando had). Max also has form for causing collisions while defending. And, finally, he most definitely has form for denying any responsibility for causing contact - something that Horner and the rest of Red Bull facilitate through how they accept Verstappen's refusal to take blame.

Stella is absolutely right: what happened during that race was a direct consequence of the FIA's failure to properly enforce the rules on Verstappen in previous seasons. Not just 2021 - it goes all the way back to his time at STR.

Verstappen is not a driver that other drivers can trust when under pressure. His mindset that combines "I must win" with "I'm better than them, how dare they challenge me" too frequently results in driving standards that are not good enough for someone who has his talent. He simply doesn't handle being put under the sort of pressure Lando put him under very well. If McLaren continues to be close enough for Lando to challenge Max, I have no doubt this won't be the last time this season we see them clash. Lando put down a marker that says "you don't intimidate me". Max won't accept that.

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Audax said:

Lots of people who follow F1 spoke negatively about Hamilton after that incident. If you didn't see it / don't remember it, you weren't paying enough attention. It was Hamilton's mistake. But it was exactly that: a one off mistake in a fraught and close battle against another driver who never gives an inch.

Max, on the other hand, has form. He has form for making very late, borderline dangerous, defensive moves that go unpunished. Because he has form for doing that, other drivers trying to overtake him also tend to resort to low percentage overtaking attempts (as Lando had). Max also has form for causing collisions while defending. And, finally, he most definitely has form for denying any responsibility for causing contact - something that Horner and the rest of Red Bull facilitate through how they accept Verstappen's refusal to take blame.

Stella is absolutely right: what happened during that race was a direct consequence of the FIA's failure to properly enforce the rules on Verstappen in previous seasons. Not just 2021 - it goes all the way back to his time at STR.

Verstappen is not a driver that other drivers can trust when under pressure. His mindset that combines "I must win" with "I'm better than them, how dare they challenge me" too frequently results in driving standards that are not good enough for someone who has his talent. He simply doesn't handle being put under the sort of pressure Lando put him under very well. If McLaren continues to be close enough for Lando to challenge Max, I have no doubt this won't be the last time this season we see them clash. Lando put down a marker that says "you don't intimidate me". Max won't accept that.

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Audax said:

Lots of people who follow F1 spoke negatively about Hamilton after that incident. If you didn't see it / don't remember it, you weren't paying enough attention. It was Hamilton's mistake. But it was exactly that: a one off mistake in a fraught and close battle against another driver who never gives an inch.

Max, on the other hand, has form. He has form for making very late, borderline dangerous, defensive moves that go unpunished. Because he has form for doing that, other drivers trying to overtake him also tend to resort to low percentage overtaking attempts (as Lando had). Max also has form for causing collisions while defending. And, finally, he most definitely has form for denying any responsibility for causing contact - something that Horner and the rest of Red Bull facilitate through how they accept Verstappen's refusal to take blame.

Stella is absolutely right: what happened during that race was a direct consequence of the FIA's failure to properly enforce the rules on Verstappen in previous seasons. Not just 2021 - it goes all the way back to his time at STR.

Verstappen is not a driver that other drivers can trust when under pressure. His mindset that combines "I must win" with "I'm better than them, how dare they challenge me" too frequently results in driving standards that are not good enough for someone who has his talent. He simply doesn't handle being put under the sort of pressure Lando put him under very well. If McLaren continues to be close enough for Lando to challenge Max, I have no doubt this won't be the last time this season we see them clash. Lando put down a marker that says "you don't intimidate me". Max won't accept that.

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Iggle Piggle said:

Absolutely this. The primary cause of yesterday was RB's and MV's refusal to accept any blame for any incident, ever, even when he has time penalties and sanctions applied. It's never their fault.

Until someone deals with the underlying cause - which Red Bull show no signs of doing and Jos certainly won't - we can expect to see repeat behaviour for many races to come. That isn't a bad thing though, at least it's competitive now. F1 is always better with a bit of needle.

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thedonkeycentrehalf said:

Not defending RB or Max here but maybe it is like football - managers will publicly defend their players while what they say to them in the dressing room is very different. I would also think Horner is trying to avoid yet another public spat with Jos V who clearly has an agenda and, if I was Max, I'd be telling to pipe down and let me fight my own battles.

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thedonkeycentrehalf said:

Not defending RB or Max here but maybe it is like football - managers will publicly defend their players while what they say to them in the dressing room is very different. I would also think Horner is trying to avoid yet another public spat with Jos V who clearly has an agenda and, if I was Max, I'd be telling to pipe down and let me fight my own battles.

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Audax said:

I hadn't seen this angle (only watched C4 highlights). Absolute slam dunk that it was Verstappen's fault, though. View from above the incident, where it's obvious that Verstappen firstly makes a late move to cover the inside, then realises Norris hasn't gone that way and fades back across to the outside within the braking zone before making contact.

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Flounce said:

He really is an irresponsible bully driver, I hope Lando keeps pushing him as hard. The FIA will have to properly points penalise him if he carries on driving like he did yesterday when under pressure, surely? A few seconds in race penalty is not enough.

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Audax said:

It won't be points ... it'll be a race ban following accumulation of penalty points. 12 points = an automatic race ban. Verstappen has 4; 2 that expire 19th November, and 2 more from yesterday that expire in a year. Generally causing a collision will attract 2 points, so he's got 3 more where he'll "get away with it". The problem is that the stewards get reluctant to hand them out if drivers get close to triggering the ban.

Magnussen is currently on 10 and *none* of them expire this year. Alonso (all earned this year), Perez (all earned last year and start expiring in Sept), and Sargeant all on 8 (6 earned last year and start expiring in September).

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Guinness Boy said:

This is very much spot on.

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