[Politics] A day that will live in infamy

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Hampden Park

Hampden Park

Ex R.N.
Oct 7, 2003
5,009
BigBod said:
What a load of tosh! Every ship in the fleet was in touch with the UK 24/7 and vice versa. Back in them days we had teleprinters in the communications office. This was linked to a crypto machine. Signals are received by Radio Automatic Teletype (RATT) Through HF receivers. We could also transmit signals in the same way using murry code tikka tape. To know if the receiving station had received your signal 100% clear and readable (ZBZ5) they would respond to you in morse code. Each signal was given a priority code to determine the time it should take for the recipient to receive the signal. The fastest was a Flash signal denoted by a 'Z' and it would be expected for that signal to reach it's recipient in 10 mins or less anywhere in the world 24/7. There were a lot of Flash signals in 82. Flash signals are rarely used in peacetime.
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Were you a sparker BigBod _._
 






Thunder Bolt

Thunder Bolt

Silly old bat
Aug 18, 2009
69,341
Beside the seaside, beside the sea
1066familyman said:
The same UN, that as the previous League of Nations, stood by as Mussolini invaded Ethiopia. The same UN that allows Israel to literally get away with murder on a daily basis. The same UN with it's headquarters in the good old US of A.

Also, the reason I mention Ethiopia is because you mention that Argentina wasn't a nation when the British first settled on the Falkland Islands.
Well, Ethiopia existed literally thousands of years before Italy was even a nation!, and it had a rich cultural heritage. Yet the League of Nations stood by and watched hundreds of thousands of Ethiopians die in mustard gas attacks from Italy, AND France and Britain were forming secret deals with Mussolini to allow him to take nearly the whole country for himself.

If you think 'the world has moved on since Thatcher' then you're sadly deluded. Geopolitics is much the same as it ever was.

In fact, given the nature of the right wing regime of Galtieri, I wouldn't be at all surprised if Thatcher conveniently allowed Argentina to invade the Falklands to garner public support for the pair of them.

Remember that Thatcher was also best friends with Pinochet, so no stranger to getting into bed with right wing dictators that disappear thousands of their own people.
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The League of Nations isn’t the same as the United Nations. Yes, there have been carve ups throughout history, but that doesn’t detract from the Falkland Islands were uninhabited in 1592, and again when the French left them in the 17th century, as they were too cold. They have a similar climate to the Shetland Islands, which came as a mighty shock to the poor Argentinian youngsters who were conscripted, arriving in their cotton uniforms.

I agree politicians tell lies and many Argentinians were pleased when Galtieri was toppled.
Life isn’t ideal and sometimes you have to choose the lesser of two evils.
 


Thunder Bolt

Thunder Bolt

Silly old bat
Aug 18, 2009
69,341
Beside the seaside, beside the sea
BigBod said:
What a load of tosh! Every ship in the fleet was in touch with the UK 24/7 and vice versa. Back in them days we had teleprinters in the communications office. This was linked to a crypto machine. Signals are received by Radio Automatic Teletype (RATT) Through HF receivers. We could also transmit signals in the same way using murry code tikka tape. To know if the receiving station had received your signal 100% clear and readable (ZBZ5) they would respond to you in morse code. Each signal was given a priority code to determine the time it should take for the recipient to receive the signal. The fastest was a Flash signal denoted by a 'Z' and it would be expected for that signal to reach its recipient in 10 mins or less anywhere in the world 24/7. There were a lot of Flash signals in 82. Flash signals are rarely used in peacetime.
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BZ Bigbod.
 


























Biscuit

Biscuit

Native Creative
Jul 8, 2003
22,387
Brighton
Eeyore said:
Watching documentaries was an eye opener. How poorly prepared the UK was.
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If you think we were poorly prepared then, you should see us now.

1982.
- 50 ships (inc aircraft carriers, destroyers, frigates and submarines etc)
- 160,000 soldiers
- 60,000 RAF

2025
- 30 ships (way fewer destroyers and frigates, and fewer aircraft carriers)
- 80,000 soldiers
- 30,000 RAF

We've gone from a personnel count of about 400,000 to about 150,000.

If Argentina wanted the Falklands now, they could just take it I suspect.
 




BigBod

BigBod

Well-known member
Dec 12, 2014
414
So I am a veteran of the Falklands War. Not a day goes by where I don't think about it. I haven't got PTSD or anything but I do suffer with survivor guilt sometimes. It has been a big part of my life for the last 43 years. I was drafted down there again in 84 for 6 months serving at Commcen Whalebone Cove just outside Stanley. Was living on one of them Coastels that weren't good enough for illegal immigrants.

I went back again in 2008 with an organised pilgrimage of 50 veterans, an amazing trip where we were put up by the locals in Port Stanley at their houses. I became very good friends with my hosts and we still communicate regularly and we recently met up when they came to Southampton to catch up with family.

I took myself down there in 2019 using a scheme for veterans where you can fly with the RAF airbridge out of Brize Norton for £250 return...Stayed at Liberty Lodge, built specifically for visiting veterans to stay at. A cracking place.

The locals are the most British and patriotic people I have ever met. Certainly confirms in my eyes that we did the right thing in 82 and has laid a few ghosts to rest by going back. I was only 17 when I went in 82, been in the Navy for 10 months and had just passed out of training when I got drafted to meet the ship in Plymouth.

I met Mrs Thatcher on the 25th anniversary. She was charming and referred to all us Vets as 'her boys' I'm proud to have been called one of her boys and I'd do it all again in a heartbeat.

I think I am just about due another visit and my 18 year old daughter is keen to join me. I shall look forward to that.
 


Eeyore

Eeyore

Munching grass in Queen's Park
NSC Patron
Apr 5, 2014
28,124
Biscuit said:
If you think we were poorly prepared then, you should see us now.

1982.
- 50 ships (inc aircraft carriers, destroyers, frigates and submarines etc)
- 160,000 soldiers
- 60,000 RAF

2025
- 30 ships (way fewer destroyers and frigates, and fewer aircraft carriers)
- 80,000 soldiers
- 30,000 RAF

We've gone from a personnel count of about 400,000 to about 150,000.

If Argentina wanted the Falklands now, they could just take it I suspect.
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I think it would be easier in the sense that the technology is so advanced now that the UK would know what was going on before they left the quayside. And with the range of weapons available, and the range of planes etc, I can't see them ever trying.
 


Eeyore

Eeyore

Munching grass in Queen's Park
NSC Patron
Apr 5, 2014
28,124
Harry Wilson's tackle said:
For the record, my view is the Falklands are ours.
The Argies can f*** Off.

But Thatcher caused the death of many people by her disgraceful complacent disregard of warnings of the invasion.

Let's not conflate the two things, here.
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I think that's important. Argentina has no right over those islands. They were inhabited by British folk even before Argentina was a thing.

But the government of the time, and possibly before, has questions to answer over how they were allowed to invade in the first place.
 


Biscuit

Biscuit

Native Creative
Jul 8, 2003
22,387
Brighton
Eeyore said:
I think it would be easier in the sense that the technology is so advanced now that the UK would know what was going on before they left the quayside. And with the range of weapons available, and the range of planes etc, I can't see them ever trying.
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I hope so. Certainly our submarines seem rather impressive, and this DragonFire stuff is interesting.

Our military deserves far more. I worry about our capability to actually respond effectively to anything without NATO support.
 




BigBod

BigBod

Well-known member
Dec 12, 2014
414
Biscuit said:
If you think we were poorly prepared then, you should see us now.

1982.
- 50 ships (inc aircraft carriers, destroyers, frigates and submarines etc)
- 160,000 soldiers
- 60,000 RAF

2025
- 30 ships (way fewer destroyers and frigates, and fewer aircraft carriers)
- 80,000 soldiers
- 30,000 RAF

We've gone from a personnel count of about 400,000 to about 150,000.

If Argentina wanted the Falklands now, they could just take it I suspect.
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They would have no chance. Did you know there is now a fully operational airbase down there that went fully operational in1985, anywhere between 1000 and 2000 personnel based there at any one time. All kinds of aircraft based there, airplanes not my thing so don't know what they are. There is an immense amount of fire power right there on the Islands. There is also always a ship on patrol down there all year round.

The Argies could never take it.
 


Thunder Bolt

Thunder Bolt

Silly old bat
Aug 18, 2009
69,341
Beside the seaside, beside the sea
Biscuit said:
If you think we were poorly prepared then, you should see us now.

1982.
- 50 ships (inc aircraft carriers, destroyers, frigates and submarines etc)
- 160,000 soldiers
- 60,000 RAF

2025
- 30 ships (way fewer destroyers and frigates, and fewer aircraft carriers)
- 80,000 soldiers
- 30,000 RAF

We've gone from a personnel count of about 400,000 to about 150,000.

If Argentina wanted the Falklands now, they could just take it I suspect.
Click to expand...
At the time, we had a small detachment of Marines in South Georgia, and again in Port Stanley. The airfield was very rudimentary. The ice patrol ship always left in April as winter set in.

Now, we have a base with a proper airfield so it wouldn’t be a case of their troops just walking in. Argentina is also broke.
 


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