Kalimantan Gull
Well-known member
Thanks for the sensible and detailed reply. I'd like to address each of your points in turn if I may, I do think you have captured most of the alternative viewpoints
I guess we can agree to differ on the first part. Brentford have two of the best forwards in the league and get it up to them, otherwise neat and solid. Fulham are just a physical beast of a side with decent talent in every position and clear roles. I wouldn't switch on to watch the football of either, I wouldn't turn them off either, and enjoy them taking on the big boys.. Bournemouth agreed have been lovely at times. Meanwhile when we have been on it we have been great. Inconsistent yes. But some of our halves of football have been absolutely superb.
Yes, many people have said that they 'can't see what Hurzeler' is trying to do. I suggest they just look harder. I have seen clear patterns of play, particularly during our recent run of good results when the team was largely unchanged and relatively unscathed by injuries. There are also many youtube videos of so-called experts dissecting it. The empty midfield is a thing, one dropping back into the back 3, the other joining the attack. It has worked. It also has not worked on many occasions. IF it CAN work long term at this level, it will be quite something. I would like to keep trying, its not as if we need to change to stave off relegation. NSC used to be a place to discuss tactics, now it is a place to say 'I don't like /can't understand his tactics, get rid'. Bit of a shame.
The Out of Possession - clear defensive structure - is a really interesting point and I think we can take the time to compare with Graham Potter. GP brought in an attacking possession-based football that overloaded up front and was such a clear contrast from Hughton's football that we all loved it. But we kept getting caught on the counter. Over and over. Seems there are teams out there who just wait for naive manager's to come along and commit too many players forward and then they pick them off at will. Quite early on Potter realised this and changed it up. Gone was a twin-pronged attack of Murray+Maupay, in came an extra central midfielder and we slowed down our play, making sure we were solid and organised before committing forward. Many of his critics on here will recognise the ensuing year and a half as the dull, rarely winning, dominating-possession-but-rarely-scoring phase. It took him ages to come up with the solution, which in the end was partly the skill of Trossard and partly the ability of Caicedo to win the ball when other teams were committing men forward, and shifting it forward quickly via Mac Allister to the attackers. RDZ just took that exact same thing and made it even better by encouraging the opposition to commit players forward, and was helped by the emergence of Mitoma and the zenith of March's career, alongside the absolute brilliance of Caicedo and Mac.
So far Fab has refused to abandon his attacking principles. Unlike Potter, who gave up his attacking verve for a more solid defensive structure, much like many of the premier leagues successful managers do, Fab is trying to work out the defensive side of our tactics whilst maintaining the attacking structure. Its brave and has resulted in some horrible results. But I would LOVE to see it come to fruition, it could be so exciting. In a way I was disappointed when Potter changed styles because I love seeing slick passing attacking football and there was some great stuff in the first few months of Potter.
At the end of the day Fab needs a top striker. That Leicester game, and thus our mood, would have been so different with a clinical scorer up front. So would the Brentford 0-0, and so would many others. He also needs some super quick and smart defenders. All of our great results have had some heart-in-mouth moments. And finally on this point, there was a period where Fab DID go a bit more defensive, at the start of the run of 6 wins. I think he was nervous at Webster being in the side, so against Chelsea in the league Minteh was almost playing as a right back in a back 5, with Veltman pushed inside, and we did that for a bit until Webster showed he was more than capable. So he CAN adapt, we can also look at Newcastle away, Villa away, but just like RDZ he doesn't want to adapt his main style, he wants to make it work, he really believes in it. Its so hard to develop something new when the crowd get on your back, when every premier league result is crucial for your job security, so he gets kudos from me for it. If we're still here one year from now, I expect I will have changed my mind and put him in the Russell Martin bracket.
All those teams have a higher net spend than us in the three years since Bournemouth were promoted. Yes we've spent a lot more in total £££, but none of those three teams have had to replace a Caicedo, a Mac Allister, a Bissouma, a Cucurella, a Trossard. Fab is bedding players in. Minteh, Gruda are obviously ones for the future. Rutter too but he looks the real deal from the start. Every manager will have favourites, players on the outside, ones who improve and ones who fade. Other clubs have recruited better, in terms of generating first team ready players, but they have a financial sustainability / PSR cost. I look at our recruitment as a long-term project to increase the total value of our squad - as I believe this is the key indicator of a club's final position. The higher the value of the squad the better the recruitment opportunities. I think it will take time to get there.
Should always give a manager time, unless they're a complete failure. Many called for Micky's head during his first season, champions the next. It takes time. RDZ was special in how quickly he did it, but the players were there. Was this a year a real opportunity at the start, coming off last years performances? I was genuinely nervous about a relegation fight. The high spend seemed to be an insurance policy in case the manager was shite. I think it became an opportunity because Fab hit the ground running, because he got them functioning again after a poor winter. In the end injuries, fixture pile up, and his own inexperience got the better of it. Year two will have real expectations. This year should never have had them imo.
We want more. We all want more. I want more. We all look at Forest and want that. We look at Villa and want that. Its ridiculous that those two giants of English football are our peers now, but its where we're at. BUT, but but but, wanting it doesn't mean it should become an expectation. Thats silly and leads to disappointment and anger and over reactions. The reality is that we have a young inexperienced manager, a young inexperienced coach, a load of injuries, and Welbeck-aside our older, wiser, experienced heads have either left the club (Gross, Lallana), are injured (Milner, March, Veltman, Webster) or finally losing their skills (Dunk). In the cold light of day its impressive where we are in the league. I don't know how much better we could have done in this scenario.
I don't disagree with this. At the time I thought that we didn't need to take the chance on someone like Fab. We could have got our own Silva or Iraola or Nuno. Maybe that was what we should have done. But its not Bloom's style, he loves the idea of unearthing the gem. He doesn't want a Silva or a Nuno. He knows that a Iraola is a two-year rental. He wants the next Guardiola and wants to take a gamble on that. So we are here and as soon as TB picks him he has my backing. No point in re-doing that decision.
Agree again, its not a good thing. Its the runs of results that allow these opinions to fester. Win one draw one lose one and its a lot calmer, a bit like Fulham are doing. The Palace double defeat is very important for some people. But I hate the personal attacks, he's a nice guy working hard to do the job that is his passion, has given us some great days already and is by all accounts popular in the club. The only thing I can do is be patient. We, Brighton and Hove Albion, are trying to crack the very highest level of the most difficult league in the world, competing with teams with a reach and a pocket that dwarfs us. Patience and time and togetherness are the ONLY way we get there.
I'm pretty sure that Hurzeler will be a big managerial success in his career. I'm far less sure it will happen here, but I'll give him a 50% chance of being our best ever manager (so far) and 50% he's gone by next June. But even if it was 5% - 95%, those are odds I would gladly accept. Sacking him just resets everything and takes away any possibility of what could be. Why would we do that? The chance is well worth taking.
Thanks for reading
