How connected do you feel to the club's values?

[Mayfair Seagull]

I don't agree.

It isn't really OUR football club when you look at the nitty gritty of the way the professional game is organised. BHAFC is a Ltd Company, and like any Ltd Company it has a Chairman, a Board of Directors, and a number of Shareholders.

This has been the case since the club was founded in 1901.

Now, what you seem to want is something slightly different - I'm not quite sure what that is, but I would like to know how you think you'd expect a Professional Ltd Company to engage with it's er, ( I'll have to use the dreaded word that I loathe most ) ' stakeholders ', in the modern world.

I get the impression from your posts that you want to be consulted at every level, be involved in every decision making process, and have a major say in the way the club is being run. Or at the very least, that you want the whole decision making process to run on a kind of ' let's hold a referendum ' or ' focus group ' set-up. I cannot think of any Professional organisation that works under such a system ( that's not to say they don't exist ), but for the most part, such engagement makes the organisation impossibly slow, bureaucratic, and unable to function satisfactorily.

If you want to exert real influence, then I suggest you talk to a member of the board of Directors, Paul Barber is probably the best first point of contact. I'm sure that if you really feel you want to make a difference to the way ihe club is run, that he'll listen to your suggestions and put it forward as an item on the next Board meeting agenda, but realistically, that's about as far as I'd expect my representation to go.

Inevitably, even as a stakeholder in the club, I don't expect to be responsible for making club policy, or executive decisions, because as I said, it isn't really a club, it's a Company, Ltd by Guarentee and Articles of association.

Your impression is completely wrong. Obviously we couldn't be consulted at every level, don't be ridiculous. What I'm concerned about is the direction the club is taking, the decisions and announcements that have been made recently and the pandering to corporates and families. It's all building into a concerted effort to oust every piece of passion and atmosphere that once accompanied an Albion game and with it, any feeling of belonging and connection too.

 

[34064 Fighter Command]

Hmmmmm........

Well if that's how you feel, then maybe you just have to accept that the world has moved on, and you have a choice to make.

The Goldstone Ground is long, long gone I'm afraid, and it isn't coming back anytime soon. However, the opportunity to play in the top tier of the English league has never ever been so close since 1991, and that surely is what the essential 'raison d'etre' of the club is all about, once every other factor is distilled out of the arguement.

 

[Mayfair Seagull]

Hmmmmm........

Well if that's how you feel, then maybe you just have to accept that the world has moved on, and you have a choice to make.

The Goldstone Ground is long, long gone I'm afraid, and it isn't coming back anytime soon. However, the opportunity to play in the top tier of the English league has never ever been so close since 1991, and that surely is what the essential 'raison d'etre' of the club is all about, once every other factor is distilled out of the arguement.

Unfortunately despite how much you and some of the people running this football club would like to believe, the world hasn't moved on and certainly doesn't need to nor should it in the direction the club is currently going. What's the end game here? A silent stadium full of prawn sandwich eaters?! wonderful.

And don't bring the Goldstone into this - that's completely irrelevant.

 

[severnside gull]

corporates and families will keep the club afloat financially and comprise a majority of the fanbase attending games. They may be quieter than the singing minority but dont mistake that for a lack of passion.

Add to that they are largely responsible for the decrease in hooliganism and I think the club have correctly identified the priorities that will take the club forward.

 

[RupertsFlan]

We have a wonderful stadium, paid for by a fan of the club.

In that stadium I have three seats bought at a very reasonable cost, though an interest free direct debit.

At that stadium I can walk along the concourse eating a local pie and drinking a local pint, chosen to reflect the wishes of the fans, whilst looking at artwork on the walls, contributed by fans, including myself.

Its absolutely still OUR club. Its just being run professionally, that's all. You simply cannot manage a club the size that the Albion has grown to, in the cottage industry fashion that existed before. It would be an utter disaster.

Someone should send this to Mr. Barber. God alone knows what some people who have worked so hard to get this whole club off it's knees must think when reading some of the drivel on this forum.

HKFC - you have struck very firmly and with alacrity, the head of the nail.

 

[seagullsovergrimsby]

The club is evolving , some issues will annoy us.

 

[34064 Fighter Command]

Unfortunately despite how much you and some of the people running this football club would like to believe, the world hasn't moved on and certainly doesn't need to nor should it in the direction the club is currently going. What's the end game here? A silent stadium full of prawn sandwich eaters?! wonderful.

And don't bring the Goldstone into this - that's completely irrelevant.

Well, if the world isn't moving on, time certainly isn't standing still.

The costs associated with running a football club at this level mean that the club cannot be run on ticket reciepts and loans from chairmen and nothing else ( we are NOT Barcelona ), it's never going to progress either in terms of attracting new supporters, or improved players. The fact is that families have, and always will be, an important part of the fanbase, whilst people who are willing to pump some of their Companies money into the opportunities that sports sponsorship provide have been important ever since they put advertising hoardings around the perimeters of pitches, and allowed companies names on shirts to be seen by a TV audience.

Now we have Sky, ESPN and the game reaches a global audience that simply could never have happened 30 years ago. To pretend that we can carry on as a club by ignoring that is to hand your competitors ( i.e. the other clubs in this league ) a massive head start.

 

[RupertsFlan]

Is it though? We actually fought tooth and nail to save OUR football club. Had we gone non-league, most of us would have carried on fighting for the club. Had we gone out of business we would have started it again like AFC Wimbledon. The status of the club was irrelevant, it's existence everything.

Currently it feels like OUR football club is moving further and further away from its hard-core supporters and is embracing everything that's wrong with the modern game in this country.

I think I understand your point. I did my bit through the dark days and yes, together we saved our club. However my personal feeling was that I was sick of being a noddy, no-mark laughing stock of a football club with no real direction or long-term future.

That cottage-industry feel of the last 15 years has been replaced by a professionally run, well-maintained and focused club with a future.

Our personal feelings will always be affected when something small and beautiful and precious is expanded and introduced to the masses. I work with Venture Captialists and seeing how businesses set up by founders and entrepreneurs is similar here. They had their love and dedication to their product - their vision.

But to make it successful and financially viable means bringing in investors, experts, new faces, new structure.

Take your choice I guess - a small time third division noddy club playing in front of 5,000 die-hard supporters that would ultimately run out of money and fold - becuase that was the only outcome at Withdean or anywhere else arguably in Brighton or the immediate boundaries.

Or - take the leap into the world of the modern professional club.

20,000 season ticket holders, an atmosphere and feel that welcomes families, a corporate element at homes games, sometimes expensive food and drink etc.

To long for the days of yore is to condemn our beloved club to the abyss. Nostalgia is a beautiful thing but it is a lethal emotion to employ when thinking of the future.

 

[glasfryn]

just voted and then though feck me I'v chosen the 3rd option and will probably be there with very few people
how wrong I was

 

[glasfryn]

Is it though? We actually fought tooth and nail to save OUR football club. Had we gone non-league, most of us would have carried on fighting for the club. Had we gone out of business we would have started it again like AFC Wimbledon. The status of the club was irrelevant, it's existence everything.

Currently it feels like OUR football club is moving further and further away from its hard-core supporters and is embracing everything that's wrong with the modern game in this country.

could not have said it better myself
I just have this feeling that the club is lurching the way of MU ..............god forbid

 

[Gritt23]

I cannot think of any Professional organisation that works under such a system

Green Bay Packers are community-owned. Just saying.

 

[RupertsFlan]

could not have said it better myself
I just have this feeling that the club is lurching the way of MU ..............god forbid

God forbid we decide that the status of this club is irrelevant - God forbid I ever leave a game of football again thinking that my beloved club are dying.

God forbid I ever go to Hereford again thinking that this could be the last time I watch them.

God forbid another Belloti or Archer gets his paws on this club again.

God forbid we are ever playing in front of 3,400 at a crlumbling relic of a ground.

God forbid we are ever beaten at home by Barnet on Bonfire night in front of less than 1,000 fans.

God forbid we ever let this club become an ageing, pitiful wreck of a once-glorious memory.

Our job, our calling as football supporters - true fans is to make sure the club is here for generations to come. If that means we have to see the more commercial element prosper and grow then that is absoutely fine with me.

Let us debate the motives and drivers of the culture of our club if an oil sheik comes in and brings Redknapp with him.

For now I will repsect the efforts of our chairman whose family have been associated with this club for decades - a shrewd man who loves the club and has delivered an outstanding part of this clubs survival now growth.

If that means I have to sometimes bite my lip when the 'Sky' feeling is apparent - then so be it.

 

[Mayfair Seagull]

Well, if the world isn't moving on, time certainly isn't standing still.

The costs associated with running a football club at this level mean that the club cannot be run on ticket reciepts and loans from chairmen and nothing else ( we are NOT Barcelona ), it's never going to progress either in terms of attracting new supporters, or improved players. The fact is that families have, and always will be, an important part of the fanbase, whilst people who are willing to pump some of their Companies money into the opportunities that sports sponsorship provide have been important ever since they put advertising hoardings around the perimeters of pitches, and allowed companies names on shirts to be seen by a TV audience.

Now we have Sky, ESPN and the game reaches a global audience that simply could never have happened 30 years ago. To pretend that we can carry on as a club by ignoring that is to hand your competitors ( i.e. the other clubs in this league ) a massive head start.

With respect, you are missing my point. My criticism of the club is that they are increasingly ONLY interested in attracting families and corporates. There seems to be a softening policy going on, sanitising our club and embracing everything that is wrong with modern football in the UK.

 

[attila]

God forbid we decide that the status of this club is irrelevant - God forbid I ever leave a game of football again thinking that my beloved club are dying.

God forbid I ever go to Hereford again thinking that this could be the last time I watch them.

God forbid another Belloti or Archer gets his paws on this club again.

God forbid we are ever playing in front of 3,400 at a crlumbling relic of a ground.

God forbid we are ever beaten at home by Barnet on Bonfire night in front of less than 1,000 fans.

God forbid we ever let this club become an ageing, pitiful wreck of a once-glorious memory.

Our job, our calling as football supporters - true fans is to make sure the club is here for generations to come. If that means we have to see the more commercial element prosper and grow then that is absoutely fine with me.

Let us debate the motives and drivers of the culture of our club if an oil sheik comes in and brings Redknapp with him.

For now I will repsect the efforts of our chairman whose family have been associated with this club for decades - a shrewd man who loves the club and has delivered an outstanding part of this clubs survival now growth.

If that means I have to sometimes bite my lip when the 'Sky' feeling is apparent - then so be it.

Wonderful post.
I'd love us to be a fan owned club but in this country and this culture at the level we are I am it's not going to happen - and I'd far rather we are where we are than having had to restart the club as AFC Wimbledon had to do although I heartily applaud them, Wrexham, Chester, and all the others (including, most recently, 1874 Northwich, formed last week from the wreckage of the Vics)
We have the best possible scenario for the British 'rich owner' football model - a lifelong fan who is there because he loves the club and has put his money where his mouth is - and as long as that remains the case, I am more than happy.
The fact that we are not a fan owned club does not mean we can't play a full part in influencing club policy, campaign for the kind of facilities we want and be heard, we have done so massively in the past, and I am confident we will continue to do so.

 

[Mayfair Seagull]

God forbid we decide that the status of this club is irrelevant - God forbid I ever leave a game of football again thinking that my beloved club are dying.

God forbid I ever go to Hereford again thinking that this could be the last time I watch them.

God forbid another Belloti or Archer gets his paws on this club again.

God forbid we are ever playing in front of 3,400 at a crlumbling relic of a ground.

God forbid we are ever beaten at home by Barnet on Bonfire night in front of less than 1,000 fans.

God forbid we ever let this club become an ageing, pitiful wreck of a once-glorious memory.

Our job, our calling as football supporters - true fans is to make sure the club is here for generations to come. If that means we have to see the more commercial element prosper and grow then that is absoutely fine with me.

Let us debate the motives and drivers of the culture of our club if an oil sheik comes in and brings Redknapp with him.

For now I will repsect the efforts of our chairman whose family have been associated with this club for decades - a shrewd man who loves the club and has delivered an outstanding part of this clubs survival now growth.

If that means I have to sometimes bite my lip when the 'Sky' feeling is apparent - then so be it.

So because of where we've come from and what we've been through we should go along happily with whatever direction the board want to take the club in? I don't think so.

 

[glasfryn]

Your impression is completely wrong. Obviously we couldn't be consulted at every level, don't be ridiculous. What I'm concerned about is the direction the club is taking, the decisions and announcements that have been made recently and the pandering to corporates and families. It's all building into a concerted effort to oust every piece of passion and atmosphere that once accompanied an Albion game and with it, any feeling of belonging and connection too.

we really do think alike
although I love the fact that we now "moving forward" and I suspect that if I were younger I would be carried along with the flow....but I am what might be considered living a little in the past and I honestly do not think this whole dumbing down of for want of a better word passion is just connected with the Albion its now very generally all over football I am always saying it has become a bit of a girls game and has become celebrity ridden for those who do not even play the game.
just a quick analogy methinks that the likes of Norman Hunter would have a permanent ban

 

[34064 Fighter Command]

could not have said it better myself
I just have this feeling that the club is lurching the way of MU ..............god forbid

I think that the club have to respond to the world as it is today, NOT as it was 1, 2 5, 10, 20 or even ( insert number here ) years ago.

The world we currently live in, is one where television revenue DOMINATES the income stream that clubs have, and provides a club with a potentially unlimited fan base. It's a world where, wether you like it or not, celebrities, sports, and information is treated as a commodity.

The club CANNOT, and shouldn't try to exist in isolation of this. Clearly there are some people on here who don't want to live in a world like this, but it's not going to go away, whatever they might think. The club has to put itself in a position where it can balance the books and ensure that it can compete in what is a league where the costs associated with attracting and retaining good players are vastly overinflated compared to what it can earn from ticket sales and merchandise. The notion that fans can have the wherewithal and money to own the club they support is frankly, a bit naive, when there is a huge disparity in the personal wealth of most fans and that of someone like Tony Bloom.

Remember Atilla, that with ownership, comes responsibilty, in particular financial responsibilty, and I don't particularly have the time, skills or money necessary to get involved in running a football club, even at the most detatched level of ownership that you might consider acceptable. So if an organisation came along where I might be offered a financial stake in the club, say an issue of shares, then I will decline the offer.

My own personal target, is that I want BHAFC to be in the English Premier League, that's a realistic and totally achievable objective. I'm not expecting a Premiership title, nor European football, but I do want to see the best players either playing for this club, or this club pitting it's squad against the best players there are, week in, week out.

What's so wrong with that?

 

[RupertsFlan]

So because of where we've come from and what we've been through we should go along happily with whatever direction the board want to take the club in? I don't think so.

Where on earth have I said that? I have given you my opinion on the development of the club and how I feel.

I have written to the club a couple of times in the last season one letter thanking them for an outstanding job they did with a family member of mine - another to complain bitterly about something had annoyed me.

Both times I recevied a thoughtful, considered response and was happy with the feedback. I am not suggesting we go happily along with whatever direction the board want to take the club in.

I have not said that at all. Please don't put words in my mouth.

I have said that 'for now' I will respect the efforts of a chairman who has the club at heart.

Have you read anything I wrote?

I don't think so.......what sort of chirlish scribble is that??

 

[glasfryn]

I think that the club have to respond to the world as it is today, NOT as it was 1, 2 5, 10, 20 or even ( insert number here ) years ago.

The world we currently live in, is one where television revenue DOMINATES the income stream that clubs have, and provides a club with a potentially unlimited fan base. It's a world where, wether you like it or not, celebrities, sports, and information is treated as a commodity.

The club CANNOT, and shouldn't try to exist in isolation of this. Clearly there are some people on here who don't want to live in a world like this, but it's not going to go away, whatever they might think. The club has to put itself in a position where it can balance the books and ensure that it can compete in what is a league where the costs associated with attracting and retaining good players are vastly overinflated compared to what it can earn from ticket sales and merchandise.

My own personal target, is that I want BHAFC to be in the English Premier League, that's a realistic and totally achievable objective. I'm not expecting a Premiership title, nor European football, but I do want to see the best players either playing for this club, or this club pitting it's squad against the best players there are, week in, week out.

What's so wrong with that?

absolutely nothing
but along the way the club should not forget those who supported them in the shite years.......instance the row over "Player" for years its not been right and just lately its been absolute tripe until the club listened to the subscribers and its now been attended to
just sometimes the little things are forgotten when in the headlong rush to the premier we listen and they will have to as well

 

[Mayfair Seagull]

Where on earth have I said that? I have given you my opinion on the development of the club and how I feel.

I have written to the club a couple of times in the last season one letter thanking them for an outstanding job they did with a family member of mine - another to complain bitterly about something had annoyed me.

Both times I recevied a thoughtful, considered response and was happy with the feedback. I am not suggesting we go happily along with whatever direction the board want to take the club in.

I have not said that at all. Please don't put words in my mouth.

I have said that 'for now' I will respect the efforts of a chairman who has the club at heart.

Have you read anything I wrote?

I don't think so.......what sort of chirlish scribble is that??

Apologies as I didn't mean to put words into your mouth. You just seemed to be saying it was ok if our club went the way of MU etc.

I agree with much of what you're saying but I do not agree that the club is currently going in the right direction. The announcement yesterday for instance was appalling.