[Politics] Labour Party meltdown incoming.......

[Weststander]

wouldn't that make their training take longer, to cover similar experience? they are paid additional for those hours too, the dispute mis-represented that, giving the first year basic pay without the shift and unsocial hours extras. and they go in eyes wide open, with ambitions of several decades career, taking on additional work, research etc. to pursue professional specialism.

I don't think they should work incredibly long shifts where their performance/wellbeing is running on empty. If that means lower 'overtime' pay, sobeit.

Eyes wide open ..... yes, they would know what lies ahead, but with a natural vocation for the medical world, they're kind of hostages to the system. I think we can do better.

 

[Bodian]

That's a lot of examples, many thanks but I see what your really getting at is that you don't like people becoming successful and wealthy. If they get promoted to a job where they are responsible for a mind boggling turnover and in your Tescos example 300k+ employees then they absolutely should be earning top dollar. It's the way of the world whether you like it or not but it's private sector and really nothing to do with you and I. Public sector is though, as we directly fund everything through our taxes, if there was a huge surplus of cash then yes I'd support wage increases but there's not. There is a mammoth amount of wastage and never ending red tape that paralyses our public sector (and private too) if we addressed those then perhaps we could offer better pay to those who serve us.

We directly fund Tesco, and other companies through shopping / train fares / bills and so on. All their money starts with us. Of course it is something to do with you & me.

 

[nevergoagain]

We directly fund Tesco, and other companies through shopping / train fares / bills and so on. All their money starts with us. Of course it is something to do with you & me.

I knew someone would come back with this, the same thing then applies to every single company and wage in the world even our beloved Dunky.

 

[portslade seagull]

You don't seem to like workers getting deals that begin to claw back the huge sums they've lost over the past 14 years. Unless you've got private medical insurance, you might find that you're increasingly dependent on junior doctors, who are leaving for better deals elsewhere.

I worked in the private sector and also missed out on huge sums for the same reasons, will the Government make up my shortfall, I also don't get a final salary pension like most in the private sector

 

[JetsetJimbo]

I also don't get a final salary pension like most in the private sector

Lol I left the civil service 15 years ago and this wasn't even remotely true then, let alone now. Just an out-of-date cliche regurgitated from the kind of tabloid that sets out to leave its readers stupider than when they started reading it.

 

[LamieRobertson]

Lol I left the civil service 15 years ago and this wasn't even remotely true then, let alone now. Just an out-of-date cliche regurgitated from the kind of tabloid that sets out to leave its readers stupider than when they started reading it.

So they don’t exist in the civil service at all then?

 

[LamieRobertson]

I worked in the private sector and also missed out on huge sums for the same reasons, will the Government make up my shortfall, I also don't get a final salary pension like most in the private sector

When you say “most in the private sector” May I ask how you know this?

 

[Weststander]

So they don’t exist in the civil service at all then?

Defined benefit schemes are the norm in the public sector. Fact.

 

[Bodian]

I knew someone would come back with this, the same thing then applies to every single company and wage in the world even our beloved Dunky.

Yes - footballers are vastly overpaid. And it's our money on tickets, TV subscriptions and merchandise that pays for it.

£5 for a cup final ticket in 1983 adjusted for inflation would be something like £17 today. Cheapest was £45 last year. We're overpaying for others to benefit, we all know that.

 

[beorhthelm]

Defined benefit schemes are the norm in the public sector. Fact.

defined benefit in public sector will usually be better than most in private. people dont appreciate the employer contributions paid on their behalf, and the security of these schemes. have to be in large multi-nationals to get anything comparible, smaller business until recently often had nothing.

 

[Is it PotG?]

The pay rise doesn't seem to be over quite yet....

"The union's junior doctor co-leader, Dr Vivek Trivedi, told the BBC the deal had only started "to turn the tide on pay cuts".

He described it as a "compromise" - the BMA had been after a 35% pay rise to make up for what it says are 15 years of below-inflation pay awards.

He said in future years the expectation was that pay would continue going up above inflation - and if that did not happen the government needed to be “prepared for consequences”.

"It does mark the start of the journey, but the journey is not over."

 

[Weststander]

defined benefit in public sector will usually be better than most in private. people dont appreciate the employer contributions paid on their behalf, and the security of these schemes. have to be in large multi-nationals to get anything comparible, smaller business until recently often had nothing.

Yes. Mrs.W’s NHS employer pays 20.8% of salary into her scheme. But even then employee and employer contributions are insufficient, a top up from the public purse of £8b a year to bridge the gap on funding public sector pensions.

Measures have periodically been taken to make it more sensible eg career average rather than final salary, also employee contributions have been upped.

 

[LamieRobertson]

The pay rise doesn't seem to be over quite yet....

"The union's junior doctor co-leader, Dr Vivek Trivedi, told the BBC the deal had only started "to turn the tide on pay cuts".

He described it as a "compromise" - the BMA had been after a 35% pay rise to make up for what it says are 15 years of below-inflation pay awards.

He said in future years the expectation was that pay would continue going up above inflation - and if that did not happen the government and the public needed to be “prepared for consequences”.

"It does mark the start of the journey, but the journey is not over."

Slight amendment to what they said and should of

 

[BLOCK F]

When you say “most in the private sector” May I ask how you know this?

I read this as meaning , ‘most in the private sector don’t get a final salary pension’. Most private sector pensions are now Defined Contribution rather than the Defined Benefit kind that Gordon Brown helped kill off.

 

[Paulie Gualtieri]

Defined benefit schemes are the norm in the public sector. Fact.

Absolutely, my mum is retiring from the NHS in a few months after 27 years service on a DB scheme. They were putting c22% of her annual wage into the pot and only required her to increase her own contributions over the last 5 years to maintain the amount.

She’s citied the mismanagement and general incompetence of management as one of the reasons why she’s had enough and is walking away, despite enjoy the social side of the role.

 

[Bodian]

Yes. Mrs.W’s NHS employer pays 20.8% of salary into her scheme. But even then employee and employer contributions are insufficient, a top up from the public purse of £8b a year to bridge the gap on funding public sector pensions.

Measures have periodically been taken to make it more sensible eg career average rather than final salary, also employee contributions have been upped.

The Local Government Pension Scheme is fully funded by members and employers. There is no shortfall and the scheme receives no top up of the type you mention.

 

[Chicken Run]

Just sharing what I happen to have seen, in the spirit of Open Government. It’s not like I’ve divulged who the group admin is and who the members are…or repeated anything like “no wonder Bert’s f***ed off to Rome. I’d have done the same.”

Because that would be the wrong thing to do. Probably.

Bert is quite literally the biggest TOOL his father ever made

 

[oxymoron]

Yet as ever, you never seem to object to the £ millions regularly paid to corporate bosses and shareholders. Bosses paid £ millions, but it's doctors, train drivers, refuse collectors, and the police who you accuse of being greedy.

Chairman of Tesco recently had his pay doubled to £10 million, while train drivers see their salaries increased (in some cases) to £65,000 - but its the train drivers, not the Tesco boss, who are denounced as greedy and selfish!

Tories really do despise ordinary working people; the proles should be seen, but not heard, and certainly not expect to enjoy pay rises which are only a fraction of what their bosses are regularly awarded.

Tesco boss's pay more than doubles to £10m

Ken Murphy's package includes a pay-out from shares awarded after he joined the supermarket giant.

www.bbc.co.uk

UK rail operator Govia awards $79m in dividends amid UK rail dissatisfaction

The dividends at UK rail operator Govia came despite recent challenges to the UK rail sector, including widespread passenger dissatisfaction.

www.railway-technology.com

Big firm bosses' pay rose 16% as workers squeezed

Analysis from the High Pay Centre suggests the average pay of a FTSE 100 boss was £3.91m last year.

www.bbc.co.uk

UK CEO Salaries: Highest-Paid Bosses Revealed For 2024

We break down CEO earnings in the UK, including the types of compensation received, and how CEO income compares to the average worker.

startups.co.uk

FTSE 100 chief executive pay at record high

Median pay for a FTSE 100 chief executive was £4.19m in 2023, up from £4.1m in 2022 - a 2.2% increase, according to new research.

news.sky.com

Bonus bonanza boosts FTSE 100 chiefs’ pay by nearly a quarter

Pay awards for 2023 likely to face ‘unprecedented’ shareholder scrutiny, says PwC

www.ft.com

https://www.opendemocracy.net/en/firstgroup-abellio-rail-strikes-rmt-shareholders-payout/

Water companies pay £2.5bn in dividends in two years as debt climbs by £8.2bn

In 32 years since privatisation £78bn has been paid out of utilities

www.ft.com

Supermarket bosses paid up to 229 times more than workers - see how they compare

Staff at some major UK supermarket chains have received a few pay rises over the last year but how does that compare to the big bosses paychecks?

www.mirror.co.uk

FTSE 100 bosses earn UK average salary in three days, says High Pay Centre

Bosses of the biggest firms will earn more than the typical worker by Thursday lunchtime, research claims.

www.bbc.co.uk

FTSE 100 bosses given average 16% pay rises

Median blue-chip index chief was paid 118 times the median full-time worker in the UK in 2022

www.ft.com

Top bosses’ pay reaches ‘eye-watering’ high

The median pay of FTSE 100 CEOs reached £4.19 million last year, the highest level on record, up

www.lrd.org.uk

And your Point ?

 

[Weststander]

The Local Government Pension Scheme is fully funded by members and employers. There is no shortfall and the scheme receives no top up of the type you mention.

I didn't mention that scheme.

The public purse meets a shortfall on public sector pensions.
https://obr.uk/forecasts-in-depth/tax-by-tax-spend-by-spend/public-service-pension-payments-net/

 

[Bodian]

I didn't mention that scheme.

The public purse meets a shortfall on public sector pensions.
https://obr.uk/forecasts-in-depth/tax-by-tax-spend-by-spend/public-service-pension-payments-net/

No you didn't mention the LGPS. BUT - we are part of the public sector, and you said it was a shortfall on 'public sector pensions'. It's just one area of public sector pensions that have a shortfall.

I just get a bit fed up with being lumped into all the 'gold plater public sector pensions at taxpayer's expense' and 'way above inflation public sector pay rises'!