[Politics] Parliament to be recalled

[Paulie Gualtieri]

Good

We used to make things in this country

 

[JBizzle]

Interesting to see the reaction from the other parties:

Reform: "It's the right thing to do"
Greens: "It's the right thing to do"
Lib Dems: "It's the right thing to do"
Conservatives: "Labour are incompetent"

The other parties seriously lucked out when the Tories picked Badenoch as leader. She's totally useless.

 

[beorhthelm]

Are you advocating the scraping of plans for the new electric arc furnace there?

isn't the problem the cost of keeping the blast furnace going? as i recall the owner was going to convert to arc furnaces, just takes some time and loses most the jobs.

 

[Curious Orange]

Are you advocating the scraping of plans for the new electric arc furnace there?

No, but I do avocate retaining the capacity to produce virgin steel. Scunthorpe is the last place in the UK that can do it.

As an aside, I'm assuming that the blast furnace there is old technology? Should it maybe be replaced with a newer, more efficient, blast furnace?

 

[Hugo Rune]

isn't the problem the cost of keeping the blast furnace going? as i recall the owner was going to convert to arc furnaces, just takes some time and loses most the jobs.

If the plant is to be nationalised, the long term plan is arc furnaces. The coke plant there was decommissioned in 2023. I see little point in investing in the past by trying to recommission coke production.

Keeping the blast furnace going is clearly the answer until the arc furnaces are complete (they have planning permission). But I imagine they'll have to buy coke in rather than produce it on site.

 

[Hugo Rune]

No, but I do avocate retaining the capacity to produce virgin steel. Scunthorpe is the last place in the UK that can do it.

As an aside, I'm assuming that the blast furnace there is old technology? Should it maybe be replaced with a newer, more efficient, blast furnace?

70% of steel in the USA is manufactured by modern electric arc furnaces. I suspect blast furnaces (that use coke rather than natural gas) are a thing of the past.

I also suspect that the investment needed to modernise has not been forthcoming from the Chinese which is why we find ourselves in the current predicament.

Hopefully, this will be a case of significant short term investment leading to long term profits, jobs and security.

 

[beorhthelm]

If the plant is to be nationalised, the long term plan is arc furnaces. The coke plant there was decommissioned in 2023. I see little point in investing in the past by trying to recommission coke production.

Keeping the blast furnace going is clearly the answer until the arc furnaces are complete (they have planning permission). But I imagine they'll have to buy coke in rather than produce it on site.

seems rather pointless to nationalise only to do what the Chinese owner was going to do anyway.

 

[Curious Orange]

70% of steel in the USA is manufactured by modern electric arc furnaces. I suspect blast furnaces (that use coke rather than natural gas) are a thing of the past.

I also suspect that the investment needed to modernise has not been forthcoming from the Chinese which is why we find ourselves in the current predicament.

Hopefully, this will be a case of significant short term investment leading to long term profits, jobs and security.

It strikes me that foreign owners were never interested in producing steel here when they could do it cheaper at home, and were more interested in increasing their market share by eliminating the competition.

 

[Hugo Rune]

It strikes me that foreign owners were never interested in producing steel here when they could do it cheaper at home, and were more interested in increasing their market share by eliminating the competition.

Sounds logical to me.

 

[vegster]

No, but I do avocate retaining the capacity to produce virgin steel. Scunthorpe is the last place in the UK that can do it.

As an aside, I'm assuming that the blast furnace there is old technology? Should it maybe be replaced with a newer, more efficient, blast furnace?

Pretty sure it's an old Coke fired system, not good for the environment and expensive as I think we have to import the Coke....younger viewers will find this quite funny but there is a much earlier version of Coke and its not what they think it is...not sure if we should re/nationalise the Scunthorpe plant, do we desperately need the steel it produces or is it a vanity project ? We ( mostly Tory governments ) were happy to let almost every other UK heavy industry wither on the vine ?

 

[Curious Orange]

Pretty sure it's an old Coke fired system, not good for the environment and expensive as I think we have to import the Coke....younger viewers will find this quite funny but there is a much earlier version of Coke and its not what they think it is...not sure if we should re/nationalise the Scunthorpe plant, do we desperately need the steel it produces or is it a vanity project ? We ( mostly Tory governments ) were happy to let almost every other UK heavy industry wither on the vine ?

Here is an interesting article on the subject, which should be read in the context that the geo-political situation has changed somewhat since last June, and brings up the interesting question of whether we have any iron ore reserves in the UK?

Does it really matter if we can't produce "virgin steel" anymore?

In short, not half as much as people might have you believe. But that doesn't mean there aren't some real problems with Britain's plans to ditch all its blast furnaces.

edconway.substack.com

 

[clapham_gull]

Interesting to see the reaction from the other parties:

Reform: "It's the right thing to do"
Greens: "It's the right thing to do"
Lib Dems: "It's the right thing to do"
Conservatives: "Labour are incompetent"

The other parties seriously lucked out when the Tories picked Badenoch as leader. She's totally useless.

I was going to post the same thing, even Farage is sort of on board. No surprise though, both major parties select utter dross when freshly out power.

That said they really picked one there though. Completely useless at politics and public office with the added value of coming across as vindictive and completely unlikeable.

 

[JBizzle]

I was going to post the same thing, even Farage is sort of on board. No surprise though, both major parties select utter dross when freshly out power.

That said they really picked one there though. Completely useless at politics and public office with the added value of coming across as vindictive and completely unlikeable.

Even more so when (yet again) the story is... Guess who sold the company to the Chinese?

"Following a period of financial instability, British Steel was taken over by the government's insolvency service in 2019 and then acquired by Chinese steel-making firm Jingye the following year."

Yup, you guessed it. The government's insolvency service. Which government, you may ask? Badenoch's Conservative one.

 

[clapham_gull]

Even more so when (yet again) the story is... Guess who sold the company to the Chinese?

"Following a period of financial instability, British Steel was taken over by the government's insolvency service in 2019 and then acquired by Chinese steel-making firm Jingye the following year."

Yup, you guessed it. The government's insolvency service. Which government, you may ask? Badenoch's Conservative one.

Like Truss she lives a post truth Trumpian sub-universe where no-one bothers to check the facts.

Unlike Trump she has zero charisma. Needs to ring Farage up and ask how to pull off a lie.

 

[Lenny Rider]

Looks like they're going to nationalise it. Looks like it's going to be necessary to nationalise it too. The world is turning.

Can they do the same with the Railways, The Electricity and Gas Supply and the Water?

 

[DavidinSouthampton]

Good

We used to make things in this country

It’s all Thatcher’s fault has long been a favourite saying in this household

 

[ROSM]

Can they do the same with the Railways, The Electricity and Gas Supply and the Water?

Railways is being done. As franchises end they are returning back to govt control. Water would be a huge cost to cover the debts of some and shareholders of all, and improvements / benefits would take generations. Electricity would mean buying back , largely from foreign companies and govts. Edf energy is French for example, scottish power is spanish and EON is german. UK power networks is owned by CKG who run Hong Kong electric. The hope is the GB energy that is run by the govt can insert a leverage into the market

 

[Randy McNob]

Here is an interesting article on the subject, which should be read in the context that the geo-political situation has changed somewhat since last June, and brings up the interesting question of whether we have any iron ore reserves in the UK?

Does it really matter if we can't produce "virgin steel" anymore?

In short, not half as much as people might have you believe. But that doesn't mean there aren't some real problems with Britain's plans to ditch all its blast furnaces.

edconway.substack.com

Well, firstly 2,700 jobs are on the line, then there are many other manufacturing industries which feed off the steel produced at Scunthorpe that would need to source steel from abroad and that would jeopardise many other jobs as, no doubt those costs would increase.

There aren't any significant Iron ore reserves in the UK that could be extracted in any financial viable way, i.e. there would need to be huge reserves to be able to compete with seabourne trade which are traded on global markets. You would need to invest many millions before you even see a dime in return. There is very good coking coal in Wales which used to supply Port Talbot by rail but other smaller mines in England rely on moving material around in trucks which is not very environmentally friendly

 

[abc]

We absolutely should be looking to make strategic investments in industries like steel in order to keep them in the UK. Longer term and beyond any one, two, three, four etc Governmental terms should be the priority and we really ought to have been making these investments a decade or two ago. Whatever the short term cost, the country will be much better off in the longer term.

100% and this goes for agriculture too. There is no coordinated food policy and we are producing less and less annually as we lose land to everything from housing and solar farms to rewilding and flood management projects.

Above all, we need policy that enables farmers to make a fair living from producing the food we all need. Otherwise the current crisis in British farming will take us past the point of being able to recover - just like steel and other industries.

Ukraine and now the current global trade crisis continue to underline the folly of relying on imports of the foods that we can produce in the Uk.

 

[Harry Wilson's tackle]

seems rather pointless to nationalise only to do what the Chinese owner was going to do anyway.

The Chinese owner was going to shut down the plant.
Could it be you are mixing ups Scunthorpe with Tata steel in Port Talbot?