[Football] The Harry Kane Problem

[MJsGhost]

No they don't lie and you've kind of helped prove my point with your post. Of those 9 knockout goals, 6 have come against:

Ukraine x 2
Columbia x 1 (pen)
Denmark x 1
Senegal x 1
Slovakia x 1

And against top level opposition, just 3, 2 of which were penalties:

Netherlands x 1 (pen)
France x 1 (pen)
Germany x 1

And I'm not sure of the relevance of bringing in Rooney, Owen, Shearer and Lineker's stats is but as you have, Kane has played nearly as many knockout games on his own as those four put together so he should have more goals!:

Rooney - 5 knockout games
Owen - 4 knockout games
Shearer - 3 knockout games
Lineker - 5 knockout games

Total - 17 knockout games

Kane - 14 knockout games

So all of them except Rooney (who was also over rated, padded his stats in friendlies and qualifiers and didn't perform in tournament after peaking at 18 - but that's another debate), had better scoring ratio's in knockout games than Kane.

I see you got there first - bloody work getting in the way mid-post!

 

[Iggle Piggle]

Potter hasn’t got the thick skin for the job. That’ll be the bigger problem

“You have to understand the game, who we played and what we did. We are sitting second in the Nations League but maybe I need a history lesson on this country. “We will continue to play with the same level of courage and bravery going forward. But for today we have to take the point and the clean sheet against North Macedonia.”

 

[Reddleman]

No they don't lie and you've kind of helped prove my point with your post. Of those 9 knockout goals, 6 have come against:

Ukraine x 2
Columbia x 1 (pen)
Denmark x 1
Senegal x 1
Slovakia x 1

And against top level opposition, just 3, 2 of which were penalties:

Netherlands x 1 (pen)
France x 1 (pen)
Germany x 1

And I'm not sure of the relevance of bringing in Rooney, Owen, Shearer and Lineker's stats is but as you have, Kane has played nearly as many knockout games on his own as those four put together so he should have more goals!:

Rooney - 5 knockout games
Owen - 4 knockout games
Shearer - 3 knockout games
Lineker - 5 knockout games

Total - 17 knockout games

Kane - 14 knockout games

So all of them except Rooney (who was also over rated, padded his stats in friendlies and qualifiers and didn't perform in tournament after peaking at 18 - but that's another debate), had better scoring ratio's in knockout games than Kane.

Who they come against is an absolutely nonsense argument. It’s not like he handpicks the opponents to play. The draw is the draw and he scores or he doesn’t.

 

[MJsGhost]

Who they come against is an absolutely nonsense argument.

Do you think it's easier to score against a team like Spain, or a team like Scotland?

 

[Farehamseagull]

Who they come against is an absolutely nonsense argument. It’s not like he handpicks the opponents to play. The draw is the draw and he scores or he doesn’t.

It really isn't a nonsense argument.

By that logic, maybe the Albion should sign Paul McCallum from Eastleigh to spearhead our attack this season after he finished as the leading goal scorer in the National League with 30 goals. It's not like he handpicked playing against Gateshead, Ebbsfleet and AFC Fylde, he still scored 30 goals.

 

[Harry Wilson's tackle]

The reason Geoff Hurst played instead of Jimmy Greaves was because there were no subs in 1966.

Did Ramsey say later that had there been subs then Greaves would have played?

 

[JBizzle]

Do you think it's easier to score against a team like Spain, or a team like Scotland?

Given we score goals frequently against Man United, Liverpool, Arsenal and Chelsea, but habitually draw blanks against Burnley, Sheffield United, Everton, Nottingham Forest etc, etc, I'm not sure Brighton fans are the ones best placed to answer in the manner that backs your argument.

In theory, it should be easier to score against Scotland, but it's not always as simple as that

 

[Harry Wilson's tackle]

I haven't seen any conclusive evidence that Kane would have taken it with good grace had he been benched yesterday.

You won't. It is a hypothetical estimation of what might have been the consequence of something different happening. I'm speculating based on Kane's lack of abreaction (or even surprise) when he was subbed off. Ordinarily, as striker talisman and captain, one would not expect to be subbed off unless you and the manager know you are 'not right'. In which case I can't see Kane being shocked and petulant had he been benched.

Anyway, who cares?

 

[JBizzle]

I think Potter would have the nous to try and play a way that could create chances for Kane, if he didn't have the balls to drop him.
Potter would fail in other ways though probably, play Bellingham as a full back or other nonsense.

Tuchel did it brilliantly at Bayern because he surrounded him with pace (Musiala), pace (Sane), pace (Gnabry) and more pace (Coman). He might not have won anything this season, but he did get Kane scoring a hat-full of goals.

For England he's got pace (Saka), then Bellingham and Foden both trying to play 10 so without any width from the left, service was absolutely awful into Kane throughout

 

[MJsGhost]

Given we score goals frequently against Man United, Liverpool, Arsenal and Chelsea, but habitually draw blanks against Burnley, Sheffield United, Everton, Nottingham Forest etc, etc, I'm not sure Brighton fans are the ones best placed to answer in the manner that backs your argument.

In theory, it should be easier to score against Scotland, but it's not always as simple as that

Point taken that it's not always simple - a lower ranking team parking the bus when facing a high-ranking side may concede fewer than a side of similar stature taking the handbrake off and going toe-to-toe.

However, I reckon there's a pretty close relationship between the number of goals a team scores per match and their opponents' ranking. If I was plotting a graph, I'd expect a pretty smooth line and a positive trend, indicating that the average (mean) goals scored per game by a team increases as the ranking of the opponent becomes worse.

 

[Braggfan]

Golden boot winner

 

[Kinky Gerbil]

If Kane wasn't fit (which it seems might be the case) - Southgates fault for playing him

If Kane wasn't following instructions it's Southgates fault for not dropping him

If he stayed on the pitch too long, guess what? That's on Southgate.

Kane was abysmal and shouldn't have started yesterday, but what did Watkins do in the 35 mins or so? Certainly ran around more, but if the teams tactic is to hoof it long, any one is going to struggle.

Could do a thread with most the team, mainly stank the place out

Tell Kane to stay in the box and actually cross the ball, he is our best finisher by a mile

 

[Kinky Gerbil]

Tuchel did it brilliantly at Bayern because he surrounded him with pace (Musiala), pace (Sane), pace (Gnabry) and more pace (Coman). He might not have won anything this season, but he did get Kane scoring a hat-full of goals.

For England he's got pace (Saka), then Bellingham and Foden both trying to play 10 so without any width from the left, service was absolutely awful into Kane throughout

Saka/Bellingham/Foden spend half the game as DMs / full backs we are so deep, absolutely no support for a striker

 

[Nobby]

Anyone got the yards run stats for the final.

Reckon Harry would have been on about 37?

 

[Harry Wilson's tackle]

Potter hasn’t got the thick skin for the job. That’ll be the bigger problem

I'd quite like to see an England manager getting pissy with the press.

The history lesson is there and ready to be invoked: we have won f*** all for 58 years.

 

[Bry Nylon]

Anyone got the yards run stats for the final.

Reckon Harry would have been on about 37?

And 20 of them were when he got subbed off

 

[vegster]

He looked pretty tired from about the time the knockout rounds started.. give him a pen, and yes he will put it away but , his game in open play is not what it was. To complicate it, he's Captain and that tends to make you fireproof when there is a need for subs to freshen it up. He might need " re-invention " as a Fox in the Box striker if he's going to make the next World Cup.

 

[Nobby Cybergoat]

For Kane in this tournament, read Evan Ferguson for us last season.

Problem 1. Being not really that fit but trying to muddle through

Problem 2. Wingers permanently looking to recycle possession rather than deliver early means that if the ball does eventually come in there's no chance to find space either if you check back or if you or try to move in behind the defence. Only one team attempted to deliver crosses early in the whole tournament. Spain.

 

[Milano]

As much as I agree that Kane has been awful in this tournament and sadly saved the worst for last, let's not allow that to deflect away from Gareth Southgate. If Southgate stays with his 'brand' of football then Kane is finished for England, if he goes then maybe a better manager might play to his strengths.

Personally I'd like to see both head off into the sunset.

 

[Nobby Cybergoat]

I'd quite like to see an England manager getting pissy with the press.

The history lesson is there and ready to be invoked: we have won f*** all for 58 years.

If Potter tries giving England fans the history lesson treatment then it won't be beer in the cups which are getting thrown at him