[News] A woman is a woman.

[deletebeepbeepbeep]

I don't know enough about this issue and I am too dumb to have any answers but all I know is that it breaks my heart to see an already extremely marginalised group of people who just want to be there true selves becoming even more stigmatised and marganalised, including people of extreme power outwardedly laughing in their faces. Solidarity with any trans men or women and everyone in between.

 

[jcdenton08]

I can’t look past this.

If I were a protestor, campaigning in a peaceful, legal manner and someone alongside me was holding up a banner which called for murder, I would seriously be reconsidering my position.

By not challenging these extremist views, peaceful pro-trans campaigners are complicit in the infiltration of their movement by terrorists with hateful and violent misogynist rhetoric.

If I was at a peaceful protest, and a fellow protestor held up a Swastika or a flag saying “The only good Jew is a ____ Jew”, or “Decapitate Trans” I wouldn’t be smiling and posing in front of their banners. I would be either leaving ASAP or challenging the terrorist in question directly.

I can only hope the police are taking these terroristic, hate-filled threats seriously and lengthy custodial sentences are handed out.

 

[Not Andy Naylor]

So, after this clarifying ruling from the Supreme Court and pages of discussion, where do we stand?

If someone has transitions from male to female, what do you classify them as?

- Still a man
- a woman
- other (a trans woman?)

And if you think it's 'other' (which on balance I probably do) then aren't there two types of 'other' - ie trans women and trans men?

 

[Curious Orange]

A sensible start:

BBC News - Equality watchdog issues interim guidance on single-sex spaces

EHRC issues interim guidance on single-sex spaces

It follows the UK Supreme Court's ruling that a woman is defined by biological sex under equalities law.

www.bbc.com

 

[dsr-burnley]

The last option is that we accept that a small number of people experience a dysphoria around the lining up of their sex and gender. We also accept that they need to take some steps to accommodate that dysphoria in order to be comfortable in their bodies.

From what i can see this decision has set us back a few steps.it has been mentioned that it provides clarity, however it doesn't seem to provide clarity for those affected. Which is a shame.

The problem is that the small number of people who are affected because they have dysphoria are being swamped by the larger number who want to believe that any male can become female just by saying so. If the latter group, who have demands that many of us find impossible to tolerate, would shut up, then the smaller, genuinely needy group would have a better chance of getting the rights they need.

 

[GT49er]

A sensible start:

BBC News - Equality watchdog issues interim guidance on single-sex spaces

EHRC issues interim guidance on single-sex spaces

It follows the UK Supreme Court's ruling that a woman is defined by biological sex under equalities law.

www.bbc.com

After a sensible and straightforward decision by the High Court, along comes the ECHR to redefine it, refine it and complicate it. Nice one, ECHR.

 

[BadFish]

The problem is that the small number of people who are affected because they have dysphoria are being swamped by the larger number who want to believe that any male can become female just by saying so. If the latter group, who have demands that many of us find impossible to tolerate, would shut up, then the smaller, genuinely needy group would have a better chance of getting the rights they need.

Or you could try being a bit more tolerant. Empathy is wonderful in these situations.

Out of interest what are the numbers of these two groups? I know a few people who identify across this spectrum. How do I tell which ones are suffering dysphoria and which are bogus?

 

[jcdenton08]

Or you could try being a bit more tolerant.

Do you not see any irony in this comment, given the images in my above post? These are people who are protesting freely amongst and therefore with the implied support of pro-trans activists.

Actually, now I think about it, almost all of the most militant, extreme views and threats of violence are coming from trans activists, not the “TERFs” they are threatening to decapitate

 

[BadFish]

Do you not see any irony in this comment, given the images in my above post? These are people who are protesting freely amongst and therefore with the implied support of pro-trans activists.

Actually, now I think about it, almost all of the most militant, extreme views and threats of violence are coming from trans activists, not the “TERFs” they are threatening to decapitate

You can see irony if you choose to but the way I see it, choosing to stay intolerant because another group is being intolerant is rather petty and unhelpful.

I don't think progress is going to be made in this by focuses on the fringes. I don't agree with what those people are saying on their placards but I also think they are less damaging than what is said by the other fringe.

You can choose to focus on them if you like but I don't really see the benefit.

 

[pocketseagull]

@jcdenton08 has been gagging to move this thread onto culture war bullsh*t. Pay them no mind. Focusing on a minority of protestors instead of the minority facing persecution is a snide's trick.

 

[n1 gull]

You can see irony if you choose to but the way I see it, choosing to stay intolerant because another group is being intolerant is rather petty and unhelpful.

I don't think progress is going to be made in this by focuses on the fringes. I don't agree with what those people are saying on their placards but I also think they are less damaging than what is said by the other fringe.

You can choose to focus on them if you like but I don't really see the benefit.

You seem like a misogynist to me. No empathy to women at all. What is the other fringe you keep talking about lesbians?
Show me one picture of this so called fringe holding a placard calling for a trans person to be hung or killed.

 

[BadFish]

You seem like a misogynist to me. No empathy to women at all. What is the other fringe you keep talking about lesbians?
Show me one picture of this so called fringe holding a placard calling for a trans person to be hung or killed.

You're not seriously asking which fringe group the placards holders are angry at? There are a few clues on their placards

If you are also unsure of what damage that group does then you haven't done enough research.

Anyway as I said if you chaps want to focus on this part of the argument (seemingly only one side of it in your case) then please do but I see no benefit.

Maybe you could start a thread about your culture wars bullshit rather than hijack this one.

 

[n1 gull]

You're not seriously asking which fringe group the placards holders are angry at? There are a few clues on their placards

If you are also unsure of what damage that group does then you haven't done enough research.

Anyway as I said if you chaps want to focus on this part of the argument (seemingly only one side of it in your case) then please do but I see no benefit.

Maybe you could start a thread about your culture wars bullshit rather than hijack this one.

JK Rowling is that who you are angry with? Has she ever said anything transphobic or held a placard calling for a transperson to be hung

When it comes to hijacking threads how many times have you posted on this one ffs

 

[n1 gull]

Who is hijacking this thread;

BadFish 67

n1 gull 6

 

[BadFish]

In the interest of keeping this thread from the clutches of the culture warriors, I have deleted it.

Apologies for getting suck into it.

 

[BadFish]

Who is hijacking this thread;

BadFish 67

n1 gull 6

Are you seriously suggesting that posting on a thread is the same as hijacking it?

Do you also think travelling on a plane is the same as hijacking it?

First day on the internet.

 

[n1 gull]

Please explain to me why asking a question about JK Rowling is hijacking a thread?

Actually don't bother. You are not very interesting. 68 posts in and you still don't make sense

 

[BadFish]

JK Rowling is that who you are angry with? Has she ever said anything transphobic or held a placard calling for a transperson to be hung

When it comes to hijacking threads how many times have you posted on this one ffs

I'm not angry with anyone. I am not one of those people holding a placard.

However, like I said, you can see who they are angry with (it's written on their placards) and should you choose to, you could find out why?

Why you are choosing not to do this and argue with me (someone who is 'not very interesting' ) is anyone's guess.

 

[cunning fergus]

The problem is that the small number of people who are affected because they have dysphoria are being swamped by the larger number who want to believe that any male can become female just by saying so. If the latter group, who have demands that many of us find impossible to tolerate, would shut up, then the smaller, genuinely needy group would have a better chance of getting the rights they need.

Spot on. Personally I think there are only 3 groups at play here.

Trans Men, the most straight forward. These are lesbians, they were “strap on” lesbians pre transition and remain so post transition. They can grow beards and have deeper voices but that’s about it, they present no potential problems or risks at all.

Trans Women, Post Transition. I can sympathise with this group, they have walked the walk. A castrated man presents a much diminished risk to genuine women, and it’s why back in the day the Muslims employed them in their Harems. Where possible, women should decide if they want them in women only spaces. They should not compete in women’s sport.

Trans Women, Pre Transition. This group are the problem, and whilst it will include those on a genuine journey to transition, it includes men who aren’t willing to go the whole hog. Eddie Izzard is a perfect example, he used to call himself a transvestite/transexual now he’s Suzy a trans woman that wants to shit in women’s toilets but is not prepared to fully transition.

Whilst there maybe a limited risk of degenerate sex cases in this group they do exist. In 2020 evidence from MOJ date was provided to a Home Office Committee, which confirmed over half the 129 men identifying as women in prison had previous sexual offences including rape.

https://search.app/CUwfhgBBRrJH1MJCA

On the better to be safe than sorry principle, all the while men have the “tools” to commit serious sexual offences they should be treated as men until they pass into the diminished risk category, a position reasonable minded transitioning men would understand. This lot definitely do not compete with women in sport.

 

[n1 gull]

I'm not angry with anyone. I am not one of those people holding a placard.

However, like I said, you can see who they are angry with (it's written on their placards) and should you choose to, you could find out why?

Why you are choosing not to do this and argue with me (someone who is 'not very interesting' ) is anyone's guess.

I've done some research, thanks for the prompt and looked at the placards

They seem to be very angry with women and especially JK Rowling

Seem like a nice bunch of lads