[Politics] Donald Trump, US President

[chip]

Sorry about the long post but this is something that has really bothered me lately when people on social media start using the Nazi Regime to press home political points about Trump.

Let’s be clear here.

America doesn’t (yet!) have an “extremist regime” anything close to a regime that systematically exterminated and killed 6 million of their own fcuking citizens in gas chambers.

NUANCE ALERT! - I also wasn’t saying comparative observations to elements of fascism is wrong or even saying Trump actually doesn’t exhibit some of the elements (and red flags of Hitler’s style of leadership). The expulsion of migrants from the US as @Thunder Bolt pointed out above is reminiscent of the Jews being stripped of the benefits of citizenship under the Nuremberg Laws. BUT it IS wrong to say America is “as bad as Nazi Germany”. While the treatment of undocumented migrants is inhumane and dispicable, Trump is NOT Hitler and asylum seekers and migrants are not being murdered in their millions.

Talking about Nazi Germany whilst implying the regime in most people’s minds is NOT retrospectively synonymous with the horror of the Holocaust is disingenuous and further trivialises one of the most inhuman and monstrous genocides in modern history.

If we want to just compare Trump talk with extremist leaders who are destroying the foundations of democratic systems of government then there are plenty of extremist leaders in the World today that make more apt and contemporaneous comparisons eg Netanyahu, Edrogan and Putin and any number of dictatorships in the African continent would serve as better examples of elected leaders who are dictatorial and extremist (some of whom, incidentally, are conducting genocide under our noses). Or if one wants to make comparisons in general with fascist leadership of the 1930s-40s, why not talk about Mussolini or Franco?

I do understand what you are saying, especially sensitivities around trivialising the Holocaust. But, and I say this as someone who is entitled to an Israeli passport (like you?), there are so many aspects of Trump and his acolytes behaviour that appear to closely resemble nazi behaiour that it would be foolish to ignore them and the lessons of history. Stalin, Mao, Pol Pot, etc. all presided over genocide. Comparison of contemporary leaders and/or parties with them does not trivialise their actions, it reminds us that we should do our best to recognise and stop extremists - and Trump is extreme by most measures.

 

[The Clamp]

Lessons certainly to be had as I have made clear several times on this thread but no suggestion in that tweet that “the US as bad’ as the Nazi Regime.

As for democratically elected governments being “overthrown”, America has been complicit in overthrowing several of them - Chile, Guatemala, Argentina come to mind for example.

Hells Bells!

Would it help if I rephrased it to say;

“There are some ways in which I consider Trump’s administration to be as bad as the Nazis but obviously not encompassing genocide in the form of the mass extermination of Jews and other so called enemies of the country”

Or perhaps retract the statement fully?

Yes. I’ll do that. I retract the post I made about the Trump administration being as bad as the Nazis.

There. All better.

 

[Zeberdi]

I do understand what you are saying, especially sensitivities around trivialising the Holocaust. But, and I say this as someone who is entitled to an Israeli passport (like you?), there are so many aspects of Trump and his acolytes behaviour that appear to closely resemble nazi behaiour that it would be foolish to ignore them and the lessons of history. Stalin, Mao, Pol Pot, etc. all presided over genocide. Comparison of contemporary leaders and/or parties with them does not trivialise their actions, it reminds us that we should do our best to recognise and stop extremists - and Trump is extreme by most measures.

Couldn’t agree more. Great post.

But recognising “aspects’ of Trump’s behaviour (and his acolytes) as resembling nazi behaviour is a very different analysis compared with making a false equivalence of America as a Country to Nazi Germany.

That was my only issue really.

Anyway - as @Clamp says, time to draw a line under it.

Sorry to bang on

 

[A1X]

Lessons certainly to be had as I have made clear several times on this thread but no suggestion in that tweet that “the US as bad’ as the Nazi Regime.

As for democratically elected governments being “overthrown”, America has been complicit in overthrowing several of them - Chile, Guatemala, Argentina come to mind for example.

Oh don't get me wrong, Trump is not Hitler.

There are aspects of Hitler's grip on power which Trump absolutely admires and wants to emulate. Ignore all the Holocaust bit, I'm talking about things like having the military swear a personal oath to him rather than to the country / constitution. He would 100% hold a Nuremburg rally if he thought he could get away with it.

 

[BadFish]

MSN

(Click on MSN)

New poll shows where Trump stands 10 weeks into his second tour of duty in the White House​

the latest public opinion polling suggests Americans may not be so pleased with the job he's doing as president.

Trump stands at 42% approval and 56% disapproval in an AP/NORC released on Monday that questioned adults nationwide March 20-24.

That's slightly lower than a Reuters/Ipsos poll conducted March 21-23, which indicated the president at 45%-51% approval/disapproval.

Trump's numbers were slightly higher in the most recent Fox News national poll, which was in the field March 14-17. Americans appeared divided on the job the president was doing, with 49% approval and 51% disapproval.

Contributing to the slide, the economy and jitters that Trump’s tariffs on America's top trading partners will spark further inflation, which was a pressing issue that kept former President Joe Biden’s approval ratings well below water for most of his presidency.

"If prices remain high, he’s going to have trouble," warned Daron Shaw, a politics professor and chair at the University of Texas who serves as a member of the Fox News Decision Team and is the Republican partner on the Fox News poll.

But Trump's favorable ratings are superior to Elon Musk

According to the poll, Musk's favorable rating stands at 36%, with 55% seeing him in an unfavorable light. (Musk is not the king or a prince)

For what is going on, those numbers are ridiculously high.

 

[Green Cross Code Man]

For what is going on, those numbers are ridiculously high.

Remember, it will take a long time for the hard of thinking's synapse to find the other synapse.

 

[Weststander]

I bet The Donald/MAGA/Vance never expected this unintended consequence.

 

[Papa Lazarou]

Corey is still going.

 

[Zeberdi]

Corey is still going.

150 million clicks on his live stream
in the US following his marathon speech.

Cory taking it to the people.

 

[Papa Lazarou]

Just broken the record and still going

 

[SouthSaxon]

Good news from Wisconsin, Musk’s millions have failed to win the state Supreme Court election there. The court remains a liberal majority.

Wisconsin supreme court race: liberal Susan Crawford beats Musk-backed candidate

Liberal judge says victory is against ‘unprecedented attack on our democracy’ after defeating Brad Schimel in the most expensive judicial election in US history

www.theguardian.com

 

[darkwolf666]

...

 

[Herr Tubthumper]

With FPTP every constituency gets exactly the MP they voted for. I think this is lost on the PR fans, who I have never had a decent explanation from of how you'd get anybody into Parliament who isn't a member of a political party.

Germany has PR and constituency seats. Regarding your last point, independents can get seats, they will need to win at least 3 constituencies to sit in the Bundestag though.

 

[Thunder Bolt]

Good news from Wisconsin, Musk’s millions have failed to win the state Supreme Court election there. The court remains a liberal majority.

Wisconsin supreme court race: liberal Susan Crawford beats Musk-backed candidate

Liberal judge says victory is against ‘unprecedented attack on our democracy’ after defeating Brad Schimel in the most expensive judicial election in US history

www.theguardian.com

A significant victory.

 

[Herr Tubthumper]

Trump is tough on illegal immigration which many Americans support but to say his policies have parallels to the Nazis is a bit silly to put it mildly.

I think it’s a bit silly to say his politicies don’t.

 

[JetsetJimbo]

Couldn’t agree more. Great post.

But recognising “aspects’ of Trump’s behaviour (and his acolytes) as resembling nazi behaviour is a very different analysis compared with making a false equivalence of America as a Country to Nazi Germany.

That was my only issue really.

Anyway - as @Clamp says, time to draw a line under it.

Sorry to bang on

Nazi Germany didn't start with the holocaust though. There were many, many steps in that direction first, and it's totally legit to call out any government taking similar steps. I don't think we need to wait for the gas chambers before we call a fascist a fascist.

 

[Bakero]

Good news from Wisconsin, Musk’s millions have failed to win the state Supreme Court election there. The court remains a liberal majority.

Wisconsin supreme court race: liberal Susan Crawford beats Musk-backed candidate

Liberal judge says victory is against ‘unprecedented attack on our democracy’ after defeating Brad Schimel in the most expensive judicial election in US history

www.theguardian.com

 

[Albion my Albion]

 

[fly high]

I bet The Donald/MAGA/Vance never expected this unintended consequence.

View attachment 199353

Had a thought, was this real. Yesterday was 1st April. Really hope it was but if totally ignored in US will it make any difference?

 

[Bodian]

Good news from Wisconsin, Musk’s millions have failed to win the state Supreme Court election there. The court remains a liberal majority.

Wisconsin supreme court race: liberal Susan Crawford beats Musk-backed candidate

Liberal judge says victory is against ‘unprecedented attack on our democracy’ after defeating Brad Schimel in the most expensive judicial election in US history

www.theguardian.com

Fake News / Election Steal / Corrupt Process, etc etc.